"How can I reliably carry out tasks when I feel stuck with overwhelm?" || Coaching Call with Sarah

The deeper reason you're feeling uncomfortable, and a practical tip you can start doing right away to see a difference.

“I never thought I could make space for something that is fulfilling, but can also be stressful and uncomfortable.” That is just one of the a-ha moments Sarah uncovered in today's coaching call. Many of you will relate to some aspect of her life, whether it's her season of motherhood, balancing full time work, or her grapple with perfectionism and fulfillment.

Sarah's initial concern is how to reliably carry out her tasks when she feels stuck with overwhelm, but as we dig deeper we uncover all of the things at play in this struggle. As I guide Sarah to look at the practical, as well as deep, changes she can start to make, you can apply the same to your circumstances.

From this episode you can take away the permission to be human and do things imperfectly. Plus, create a practical habit that will help you refocus in those moments of overwhelm that we all experience.

About a few other things...

Reclaim your creative power and rediscover who you actually are! If you’re ready to come back home to yourself, to be able to say that you know who you are and what matters to you, take my foundation course, “Finding Me.” It’s OK that you’ve lost parts of yourself along the way; but as you learn to anchor back into who you are and align your life to what matters to you, you’ll find that you have more strength, more fulfilment, and more creativity to bring to your important roles and responsibilities.

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Songs Credit: Pleasant Pictures Music Club

TRANSCRIPT

Monica: Sarah welcome to about progress.

Sarah: Thank you. I'm glad to be here.

Monica: I'm looking forward to coaching you today and to start us off, I'd love for you to give our fellow progressors and introduction.

Sarah: So I'm, I'm Sarah. I'm a mom, I'm a working mom. I am married, been married for 10 years and I have two kids. And few years ago I decided to start working more full time and it's been kind of an adjustment trying to do that. And trying to balance between work and home.

Monica: That is a big adjustment and I've heard it in every direction, no matter what the direction is that you're going, it's always an adjustment. So Sarah, tell us why you are here today.

Sarah: So I. I struggle with accomplishing tasks and sometimes at work, I feel really overwhelmed. And so I get behind and it's hard for me to get things done. I'm kind of a perfectionist.

Monica: Hmm. Okay. So perfectionism is getting in the way of finishing tasks is the main issue or anything else you want to say about that?

Sarah: Yeah, I think my own feeling of, I have to get it done. Right. And it's going to take X, Y, and Z. And so I kind of procrastinated and I get overwhelmed by it. But also my supervisor is also a perfectionist, which doesn't help. And so he has very clear ideas of what he wants and sometimes we just need to call it.

Good. Good enough.

Monica: Okay.

So that's a tricky balance because there's an internal perfectionism going on, but there's also a circumstantial perfectionism going on as well. And, and if you were to, to kind of name the big problem here as a question, but with that.

Sarah: I would probably say my big question is, "how would I reliably accomplish these tasks, even when I feel overwhelmed and behind?"

Monica: Okay. So the key words there for me are reliably because that's what happens with perfectionism and actually makes us feel less consistent and predictable. Maybe due to some procrastination going on because of the overwhelm

Or feeling scattered?

Sarah: Sometimes I, can be high achieving because of my perfectionism, but other times I just don't do anything. And I do like numbing behavior.

Monica: okay. Nobody's judging you by the way, because this is so so normal and on the way where I'm saying you're normal, but to kind of comfort you, you know, this is what happens with the pendulum swing of perfectionism it's that either or ,all or nothing, and you swing back and forth, especially when you're paralyzed about the outcomes.

I want to ask you a question about that, because that might be a factor too, and then we'll get into some of the coaching here. When you don't feel like you're being consistent and completing your tasks. What part of that has to do with the outcome or your fear of the outcome or your pressure of the outcome?

How does that play a part and maybe it doesn't.

Sarah: Sometimes when I'm paralyzed, it has to do with, this is a really big project and there's a lot of different components and I want it done right. And at times it's, I, it's going to take a lot of work and I'm not sure how to start or where to go throughout. Like, I, I don't know how to see through every step and it's going to take some figuring out and I get overwhelmed with that.

Monica: And how often does that overwhelm kind of paralysis slash numbing behavior, procrastination behavior? Like how much, how often are you dealing with that? Like if you were to look at a normal Workday, is this happening every day or is this like during certain times of the week or the month?

Sarah: I would say almost every day. Some, sometimes I have good days where I look at my master to do list and then I can knock a few things out. But I would say probably every day, especially after lunch when, after I take a break and I come back and I'm like, oh no,

Monica: Hey, this is actually really helpful to learn because we can target a specific time of day for you as a way for you to get some training in this and practice and learning, you know, just kind of getting into the place where you feel more confident about even that time of day, which will trickle down into other parts of the day or the weeks or within projects that you're struggling with.

So that's really great to know that. Okay. So there's two big directions I'd like to take this with and the first is more practical.

And the second is a little bit more deep. So let's start with the practical, if that's okay. And then that kind of actually helps us get the juices flowing so that when we go into the deeper stuff, we have more information.

I dunno if there's things that we learned along the way at the practical side. So what, what I really see a big problem with is one, the overwhelm, of course, but that to me has to do more with perfectionism. So we're going to hit on that later, but. That shift between lunchtime and work time. It almost gives the window for the anxiety to step in and be in charge.

And, and the fear that is related to that. And because of this, I think, you know, in the, in the self-development world, we would just call that as a task switching time. You're switching frames of mind. You're switching from a break to feeling like you're giving to yourself kind of even just with lunch, you know, to feeling more beholden, to needing, to be more duty bound, to do work.

And so not only is a past shift, but it's also kind of a persona shift. It's a shift in, in the way that you view yourself and your capacity to show up. Does any of that resonate with what you experience?

Sarah: you know, I, I, don't one thing that came to my mind. I don't know if this relates, but the reason why I decided to work was for fulfillment and as a, as a mom, I mean, my, my husband said that, you know, I don't have to work and he probably would prefer that I stay home, but I made that choice for myself and I don't have to.

And so the fact that I work, I want to find fulfillment from it. And if it becomes a duty bound, kind of like a, I have to do this, or there's so much I need to do it kind of defeats the purpose for me. It takes an enjoyment for me.

Monica: So do you feel like a lot of times the, in that anxiety over this needs to be fulfilling? Is that also playing a part in your, in your struggle to show up?

Sarah: I think it sometimes does actually, because it, it makes me think that if it's not fulfilling the why, why am I doing it then I should, I should stay home. I should be a full-time stay-at-home mom. If it's not working, there's guilt associated with not finding fulfillment. Okay,

Monica: I see that guilt in the driver's seat even with that task switching, because what you're doing is you're creating these expectations on yourself that when I do this work, not only do I need to do it well, which is a pressure we're going to talk more about, but it needs to feel fulfilling, meaning it needs to feel rewarding and good.

And like myself. Like, stress-free basically,

Sarah: right, right there is that expectation. I see that.

Monica: I'm going to just tell you one thing personally about me. K. My work is my fulfillment too. It's where I get a lot of my own personal growth and fulfillment. I feel like myself. And it's also stressful. overwhelming at times it gives me anxiety. It makes me question myself. It makes me uncomfortable.

Sarah: Yeah. I guess I never, I never thought I could make space for, you know, like what you're saying that it's fulfilling, but it can also be stressful and uncomfortable.

Monica: And if you were to, and I'm not telling you what's right or wrong with what you're just going to decide to do. And I know you're not trying to make that decision right now either, but just even that looming cloud of, I might have to decide to not do this anymore. I think is impacting your ability to navigate what fulfillment through your work actually looks like realistically.

Obviously there's going to be lines. Like obviously there's going to be lines in the sand where you can say, you know, no, this isn't right for Macy's and right now, no, this actually is not overall leading to fulfillment and helping me feel like myself. So I'm ready to forge a new path, whether that's with another career or choosing to stay home.

So I can see, I can see this is bringing some stuff up for you. Tell me what's going on.

Sarah: Well, I feel, I definitely see that I have this expectation on myself that because I'm carving my own path in working and being a working mom, I have all these expectations of how fulfilling it should be and how great it should be and what, and what kind of outcome I get from it. And it definitely is. Adding a layer of guilt and burden on me at work. It affects my work, like what you're saying. And I see that and I'm starting to realize, I somehow need to make like a mind shift change of this is what I'm going. I'm going to find fulfillment, but I'm going to say that the expectations are different now.

And I don't know how to do that jump. I'm not sure what that looks like. That fulfillment looks like anymore.

Well,

Monica: Well, we can talk about that for sure. And I think it really can just start with this, this belief: fulfillment can still be uncomfortable. Fulfillment can still stretch me. Fulfillment can still challenge.

Sarah: Hmm, I like that. I think that that resonates fulfillment can still be stressful and challenges me.

Monica: This is going to happen no matter what you do, whatever season of life you're in, whether you were a stay-at-home mom full-time or working mom full-time or a little bit of both, whether you choose a different career path.

Sarah: Yeah.

it's true. I mean, as a full-time, when I was a full-time stay-at-home mom, it was not fulfilling and stressful and uncomfortable. And so at least I have the fulfilling side when I work, but I didn't anticipate the stressful and uncomfortable part.

Monica: In the past, when you were more of a stay-at-home mom, I think this push that you must be fulfilled by, it leads to resentment. Okay. Especially when you're like, I must be fulfilled by this at all times. And why am I not? And it kind of sends you down the spiral of both anxiety and fear and self blame, but also like blaming of the people you love, which doesn't feel good.

But this can also on the flip side, this pressure that you must be fulfilled by your work at all times. It's not lead to resentment as much to me as much as just straight up fear,

Sarah: Just fear,

of, it's not fulfilling for me. So what do I, you know, what do I do? Is it this the right thing? Or,

Monica: which is making you demand far more of it than need to, which is also sending you down those procrastination trails and yeah, the numbing behaviors, because the expectations are just so high, either way, you have unrealistic expectations yourself and, and either way you go, it's a shift on what fulfillment looks like.

Sarah: Yeah. Yeah. I definitely see that now. Cause I studied in college teaching and I was a history high school history teacher. When I

Monica: was too, this, I love hearing that and English too, but yeah. Okay.

Sarah: Yeah, English. I, Yeah. I've heard that from you. And I loved what I did. I, it was fulfilling, but it was also incredibly stressful. I mean, it was like first-year teacher stuff, you know, so, so bad and just hours and hours of work.

And and then I went into substitute teaching once I was a mom and it was a lot less stressful but less fulfilling. And I now looking back. So I've been, there've been thoughts in my mind. I'm always a failure, no matter what I do, I'm never fulfilled or like I always have stress. I always have, whether it's a teacher or a full-time mom, or, you know, working as a researcher, a historical researcher, but now I'm realizing maybe those were fulfilling, but they were also stressful and also uncomfortable.

Monica: Well, and like we said, there's always a line. So similarly I felt the same way about teaching. It was incredibly fulfilling, but the stress and the lack of balance in my life outweighed what I was able to provide I think, but it seems like your fear of that is getting in the way of you actually creating it.

So what you kind of need to do is let's work on this mindset shift and then see how that helps you show up differently. So your work, and then you can hit the pause button on. I must decide either way. And I know again, like you didn't come here and say, I'm trying to make a decision, but it does seem like even the threat of having to make a decision.

Is really affecting the way you're showing up.

Sarah: definitely.

Monica: So I'm going to tell you something that I had a therapist that I worked with for years, who just changed my life, but perfectionism is so sneaky. I didn't realize it was showing up for me and all these other ways. You know, I'd worked on other very obvious ways, but not the sneaky ways.

And she asked me this question and I'm going to pose it to you now. And she said, Why is Monica packer not allowed to be human? And I'm going to ask you that.

Sarah: Um,

Monica: Is Sarah not allowed to be human?

Sarah: Hmm. I think that question is it's a little triggering for me

Monica: Mm.

Sarah: cause I, I do realize that there are so many things I want in my life. And so many times I tell myself I can't.

Monica: Hm.

Sarah: I should, or I have these high expectations, you know, and I don't know why I don't, I don't know why I don't allow myself to be human in that regard, but I think, you know, I don't know.

I feel like my, my idea of, of mom and my idea of a worker. Is inhuman. It's a robot, you know, a mom who could do all of these things, a worker who can do all of these things.

Monica: Yes.

Sarah: I don't know, I don't know why.

Monica: I mean, yes, in many ways, this is modeled to us. It's directly taught to us. It's influenced our culture. I mean, there's a lot of actual reasons. So when I ask you that question, I don't want you to self-blame again, I don't want you to go down that spiral too, of saying, look at me, I'm wrong. Like, I can't even.

Fix this perfectionism. That was another part of my past too, is like I'm okay. So I'm going to fix this overnight. Right? And then once I didn't, I blamed myself again. So when I asked you that question, I want it to do two things. I want you to remove the self-blame. Say no wonder why I feel this pressure.

Here's why here's some reasons. And maybe you can think of that for yourself. Like, oh, it's. There were expectations on me growing up about how I need to be. There's expectations on motherhood. Maybe I have religious expectations. Maybe I have familial. Maybe I have social expectations and, you know, just zoom in to see, okay, these are the reasons.

And then the second reason I'm asking you, this question is so you can give yourself permission to be human. Because for some reason, and not for some reason I understand the swell, but for some reason, our brains do this, this demand on perfection is not letting us show up the ways that we really could.

It's it's tapping down on our potential. It's it's stamping out. It's stamping out, not only the fulfillment, but it's stamping. The actual ways you could show up and weirdly giving yourself permission to be human helps you get past the overwhelm and anxiety and take action. And because of that, make more mess, but also make way more progress.

I have grown way more as I've given myself permission to be human. Then when I demanded perfection for me,

Sarah: Right, right. I'm trying to think of what that looks like. Giving myself permission. I mean, I can already think of reasons why, when you were saying like for example, religiously, I've always viewed there's a right way and the wrong way. And in my, and I think it bleeds into every aspect of my life.

There's a right way to be a mom. And there's a wrong way to be in the right way. Is. Doing every different aspect you can think of to the best of my ability. And when I say the word best, I don't mean the best at the moment. I mean, like the best that I could ever do it. And I have that expectation on myself to perform all the time, that way.

And it bleeds into the right way at work too.

Monica: there's a lot of reframing here. Right? Especially when even I think about this with my kids, like I can read a book out of fear or I can read a book to them out of love and they know the difference. And I know the difference. It's the same with these, you know, for you, religious guidelines or morals or values, you can live them out with love, or you can live them out with fear

Sarah: Yeah.

Monica: and you will feel the difference.

Sarah: Yes.

Monica: So it's not like let's throw the baby out with the bath water. Like, although maybe that's going to be part of, of you figuring this out. It's like, what are actually my values

Sarah: Right.

Monica: and how do they, you know, cross over with, with the religious values that I was raised with, or either expectations and maybe where, where are ways that I'm making them more than they need to be, or I misinterpreted them or. They don't have to be applied that way, you know?

Sarah: Yes. Yes. Making them more extreme than they were intended.

Monica: So I promised you, we would start with the practical and what I love about this is we actually went deep right away because we needed to, and it helped us figure out what was actually going on here, which is a lot of shoulds, a lot of pressures. A lot of internal expectations that are unrealistic and harsh. And so I will be straight up honest with you, Sarah, and this will not be an overnight thing to fix, but I will also be honest with you and tell you, you will be able to fix this, but what you need to be willing to do is to move into the discomfort zone.

The good kind of discomfort that is actually helping you grow, which means for you. I think you have to be willing to do things messily and tolerate the discomfort that's going to bring. As you learn how to navigate. Okay. So this time I showed up messy, like I came back from lunch and I told myself I could do a terrible job on this thing.

I did it. And that actually helped me create momentum. And then I was able to take that terrible thing and make it better. Or another day you're going to say, I gave myself permission to do that terrible thing, and I did it terribly and I did it terribly.

And learn from it.

Figure out, okay. Well, this is, this is what I'll do differently next time, but what does that bring up for you?

Sarah: I think it, it seems almost. I mean, part of me just thinks of, I I've been trying to tell myself, I think this is like a mantra of of "good enough." And I I'll often say like, okay, this is good enough or good enough. But I find myself having to remind myself in the details, like, as I'm writing, I'm always editing and it's like, whoa, wait, let's just write the email, finish it, and then we'll edit it.

And. It's really hard for me to like pause and like okay, no, we're going to redirect. Just do it. It's kind of

Monica: that's a, that's a muscle in your brain, right?

Sarah: yeah, it's a natural reaction for me to keep correcting, perfecting and it's like, no, I want to.

Monica: Okay. So what we want to do is kind of create, and this is where we can get into some of the practical side, but first well let me say what I'm going to do with the practical stuff. We want to help you feel more grounded coming into work. And we'll start with just the, that lunch to work, transition, that tasks switching we'll help you come up with a way to feel more grounded, but underneath all this, we have the foundational mind shifts that we are trying to work on.

And I would just like to say. Can you name some of those for me? And this isn't a test. I just want to see like, what was resonating with you. They're like, okay, good enough. As a mindset shift, what are some other ones that you would like to work

Sarah: Maybe the idea that I will do a terrible job intentionally.

Monica: Yeah, I can be, I can be terrible.

Sarah: I can, I can do a terrible job.

Monica: Yes. Okay. That's permission.

Sarah: Yes.

Monica: Permission to be messy.

Sarah: yes. That's a big shift for me.

Monica: That's by the way, how I get like any episode done is terrible work.

Sarah: awesome. That's so foreign to me.

Monica: Was for me

Sarah: a little uncomfortable.

Monica: full, full understanding. But as I, as the more you do it, the more natural it feels, it really is like a muscle. Okay. What else? What are some other mindset shifts?

Sarah: Maybe it's in this case, this goes a little bit into beliefs, but our identity it's okay to want what I want in life. I don't know That one's kind

Monica: huge.

Sarah: Yeah, that one's really hard for me to accept, to be honest.

Monica: We could do a whole episode just on that one.

We're going to have a lot of guilt for having wants,

Sarah: Yeah.

Monica: but to me, that is at the heart of identity is having your own desires to call your own.

Sarah: Which is such a counter-intuitive thought for me religiously, just to think that like, at the bottom of it, it's my desires. And yet just, for now, I don't know if I want to pursue them, but I just want to be okay with having them just, Yeah.

I just want to recognize what they are and that I have them.

That's just one step, you know?

Monica: Yes, that's, that's honestly the most important step I think is giving space to once and you can just let them hang up for now. Okay. That's a

huge one.

Sarah: Yeah.

Monica: Anything else?

Sarah: Mindset. Maybe something about with my boss also being a perfectionist and so being like it's okay. If he's disappointed.

Monica: Yeah.

Sarah: Cause I know that he's used to me being a perfectionist and performing at that level. So maybe going forward. Okay. If he's disappointed.

Monica: Yes. It's harder when it's like your shift and expectations is butting heads with someone else's expectations. So I think that's something you can just expect. That's going to be part of the discomfort zone you're willing to move into now is learning how to navigate that and have some boundaries and to still be a really good employee, but still, you know, setting like, Hey, I will have this for you by this time, you know?

Sarah: In whatever shape or form it turns out,

Monica: Yeah. Yeah. And even just having that transparency like this, one's just a messier version of it and we can work on, you know, the rest of it,

Sarah: right? Yes.

Monica: like that. Okay. Any other mindset shifts and if not, that's okay. Just want to make sure.

Sarah: Yeah, I think that's all I can think of.

Monica: So I'm just going to review this with you. Good enough.

Permission to be terrible. It's okay. To want what I want. And it's okay to disappoint.

Sarah: Those, those are big ones.

Monica: They are big.

Sarah: Yeah.

Monica: So these are the ones I want you to kind of hold on to. I mean, maybe you can even write this for yourself and put it next to your workspace. Or have a, I know it sounds so cheesy, but it makes a huge difference to make something visual. I learned that even with my DSL list or my goals or a kind of mindset shift I'm working on too, is just to have it in a commonplace.

So maybe you can choose one or two of those or all of them and display them for yourself and, and also be willing to do the deeper work, which we are clearly not doing today, but we have started, we've planted the roots for you or the seeds rather for you to do deeper work in these areas.

 now let's just hit a practical way.

You can begin in the moment. Of grounding yourself and actually might involve some of these as mantras for yourself. But with task switching, it's not just like you're switching the tasks you're doing. You're switching your brain and your brain is expecting things at such a high level of performance that it's no wonder you self-sabotage through either numbing behavior or procrastinating, or if you're like me too, getting busy with other things that don't need to be done even within work.

It's no wonder it makes sense. So we want to be able to help you shift from lunch, to work with a sort of ritual that will help you feel grounded. That will help you feel like I can show up messy that this is who I am and who I'm raising. One other mindset shift we should have had as part of things is fulfillment can be uncomfortable.

Sarah: Yes. Yes.

Monica: And that, and that being part of like the shift for you

Sarah: Wow.

Monica: now, I don't want to give you a prescription, but what are some ideas you have about maybe this after lunchtime ritual?

Something you do with your body, by the way, it's usually something you actually do. Whether it's like you have a mug of hot tea and you take a deep breath and you say a mantra, or you light a candle, or you play a certain album that gets you in the zone. It helps you shift because this is the music you pair with deep work, you know, things like that.

So I should have given you some ideas.

Sarah: Okay. So there are a couple of things, actually, when you said that I have like three things that came

Monica: Oh, yay.

Sarah: One thing is I like to drink pero it's like a barley tea. And so I have like a mug of pero that I usually get after lunch.

Monica: Good.

Sarah: And that one seems to be kind of calming for me. It's like a warm. And then the other thing is I like to just do. Breathing like 10 breaths, kind of a thing, like a yoga with 10 breaths,

Monica: Okay.

Okay

Sarah: a pose, I guess, with 10 breaths. And then the third thing I thought of was I love pump up music and so use all play like something with SIA or something like that.

Monica: Oh yeah.

Sarah: and it will help me get in the mood of, you know, like I've got this.

Monica: So, which of these do you typically do? Most days already.

Sarah: My pero.

Monica: Okay, cool. So now we can create a when then pairing for you. We're doing a little habit formation. When I finished making my mug of pero, then...we're going to have really simple then now, like the 10 deep breasts. I love that idea, but your simplest version of that should be your baseline, which might be just one deep breath while you're holding your mug of pero at your desk, or you play one song

Maybe for now, you just choose the song that's going to be for the next little while.

Might be a couple of days, might be couple months, you know, until you get sick of it. But with time, what this could be as a whole ritual. When I'm finished creating my pero, I'll sit at my desk and take 10 deep breaths and then listen to a pump up song.

Sarah: Okay. So I could do like all three of them in my ritual?

Monica: Yeah. Yep. But in the beginning it can just because perils already part of your routine, we can attach. One thing too, for now, I would say, and then you can build towards adding a song and it actually, this, this might not even happen intentionally. It just might happen organically, which is actually how habit building habit stacking happens.

Most of the time is just organically. You're like, I can take another deep breath or then you're like maybe after three breaths. Oh, I want to say this mantra to myself. It's okay. I'm okay. Or something like that, you know, I can go for good enough.

Sarah: Right.

Monica: And then you're like, hope, you know what? I actually want to play the song while I start this email or do this project, you know, it can happen organically, but in the beginning, we don't want to give you this whole routine as a ritual.

We just want to give you a small way to start a foundation that can build up. So what could that look like for you? What would you like after I get my mug of pero.

Sarah: I like the idea of taking like maybe three breaths.

Monica: And 3 deep breaths. Is that something you could do on your worst day?

Sarah: Yes.

Monica: Okay, then you've got it. That's your baseline? Three deep breaths.

Sarah: Yes.

Monica: Great. And then you can build from here, add a mantra. If you want to add in the song. But I think that it can be that simple and this might sound so like oversimplified to people are like, okay.

So like a little ritual is going to make all her problems go away. And the answer is no, but it will help create a consistent way to ground yourself. As you're also doing the deeper work that we were talking about earlier, about how to reframe what fulfillment looks. What a good job looks like. What it looks like to be a quote unquote, good employee, a good mom.

The wants, all of that.

Okay. How has that, how does that all sound for you?

Sarah: I like that. I think it's a simple transition. I can do it in my worst of days. Three deep breaths. I could add a mantra maybe from like a visual that I see I'll pick a mantra or something.

Monica: Okay. I feel like we're leaving, leaving this coaching cal. Hopefully just even a little bit better. Then when we started, I always see like a visual difference. I can, I can tell if we've helped you get there just even a little bit, but this is just the starting place. And I know you're going to build, and I also know as part of that, you're going to meet some resistance right away.

That's what happens. Your brain is going to be stretched in ways that it's going to challenge these reframing so that we are working on as well as even challenging this ritual. I just want to encourage you to persevere. To be willing to move through that discomfort and ways that are not a betrayal of self, but a way of actually honoring yourself.

Like, I am willing to move through this discomfort because of who I want to be.

Sarah: okay.

Monica: And to not blame yourself, like, let's say tomorrow, you do the ritual and you still find yourself in that, that same kind of behavior, avoidant behavior.

Sarah: Right.

Monica: It's not that the ritual did. It's not that you're not doing a good job.

Don't blame yourself. Expect it, expect that it's going to take a while for your brain to be retrained, to show up differently, both for yourself and your work.

Sarah: Okay. Okay.

That's

Monica: doing the ritual, keep working on the mindset shifts and doing the deeper work.

Sarah: okay.

Monica: might involve some coaching or therapy, or it might just involve you taking time for yourself more and journaling through this and going on walks and thinking about it, talking to a friend more who maybe is like a step ahead of you on this journey.

It can be like that.

Sarah: Okay. All right. That's good to know.

Monica: If you, if I were to ask you, okay, what's, what's the thing that you want to make sure you remember from this call, what would that be?

Sarah: Definitely the ritual that's what I'm going to implement. Also I I've, I'm exploring some insights into my own beliefs and ideas about fulfillment and that's something that I want to work with and work on and dig, digging into more. So that's something that I'm taking away is there's more, there's more to do.

Monica: No, there's always more. And that's the thing. There's always going to be a gap and that's part of being human. I have gaps too. I have things that I'm like, oh, I want some more work to do on that, but you're, you're, you're on the right path.

Sarah: Awesome. Yes, I feel good about it.

Monica: Great. Well, thank you for your time, Sarah. I really enjoyed that.

Sarah: Yes. Thank you, Monica. Thanks for helping me.